Well I'm Hot Blooded, Check it and See...

[taste_is_sweet]

For them's what might be interested, there is a multi-fandom commentfic meme going on at ariadnes_string's LJ (don't know her, but the woman has good ideas).

This particular meme is all about fevers, which as we all know tend to be awesome in fiction and kind of horrible in real life. (My mom got Dengue fever right after a Habitat for Humanity trip to Haiti many, many years ago, and at one point her poor brain was so fried that she honestly thought she'd been a victim of a voodoo curse. Definitely not fun to witness at the time.)

I've gone through all the comment prompts and read almost all of the finished fic(lets), and I've been grinning like the wicked, H/C junkie fangirl that I am. Except for one little thing that I just don't get.

So far, every writer who's actually said what temperature the suffering, delirious woobie has reached has written it as being no higher than 102 Fahrenheit (about 38.9 Celsius). Now, I've had a fever that high and let me say in no uncertain terms that it sucks balls, but that's nowhere near high enough to cause delirium.

Generally, people don't start hallucinating or thinking they've been cursed until their fever hits 104 F (40 miserable degrees Celsius). Temperatures of 105 (40.5) and up are where you drag your raging teammate outside into the blizzard so you can bury him in snow before the brain and organ damage starts.

Now, it is true that the faster a person's temperature rises, the more likely they are to have febrile seizures. But a normally climbing fever that gets to 102/38.9 will probably make you want to die, but it won't make you see the Grim Reaper and his flying monkeys coming through the window to help you get right on that. There's a good rule-of-thumb chart right here.

Obviously not everyone will react to a higher-than-normal body temperature in the same way, but it still struck me as odd that a temperature 102/38.9 would be considered dangerous. Have any of you guys had different experiences? Am I wrong? Enlighten me, FList! :D (Passes out the Tylenol and Paracetamol.)

Comments

[twistedhilarity.livejournal.com]

I know of one person I've ever met who would get hallucinations from a 102 fever. Every other person I know, including myself, seems to feel like crap but that's about it. Heck, the kids and I all had 104 temps from a flu a couple years ago, and we didn't want to move and felt like were were going to freeze to death from shivering, but even that didn't make any of us hallucinate.

I wonder if just a lot of people take so many drugs to keep down the fever that they don't even know what it's like anymore. :-P

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

It's quite possible. :) People are so used to not feeling sick that they don't remember how craptastic it actually can be...

I hope your friend with the delicate brain never, ever moves to a warm climate!

[sholio]

I had a fever of about 104 when I had the flu this past winter, and not only did I not hallucinate, I didn't even feel THAT awful. I was just too tired to move. Nor did I feel the urge to bathe myself in ice water to bring my temperature down.

I imagine that people's bodies probably react differently to fevers, so I can't rule out the possibility of a person being delirious at 102, but I suspect that it's just a case of research!fail. Like the hypothermia fic I read awhile back in which the character was near death with a body temperature of 97.

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Man, I wish I had your stamina! The fever I was talking about above was either 102 or slightly under, and every single part of my body hurt down to my hair follicles and I didn't want to move.

I agree that it's possible for someone to be delirious at 102 (twistedhilarity above mentioned as much), but not likely across, say, three different fandoms full of adult males. ;-> And yeah, I have a colleague whose normal body temperature is 97 degrees F. I don't even think you hit a real danger zone until you're under 80.

[jak-frostty.livejournal.com]

My baseline temp is just below 97, does that mean I'm dead? XD

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

I have a friend who has the same kind of baseline, so I doubt it. But I'd hate to think of you getting a temperature above 103... ;->

[jak-frostty.livejournal.com]

Highest I ever remember getting since my teens was 102. Wasn't at the hallucinating stage but I felt like I'd been hit by a truck after drinking about 5 beers (and I'm kinda a lightweight).

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that sounds about right. :( The last time I had a fever like that I hurt so much I thought I'd actually strained my back muscles. God, it's horrible.

[sgamadison.livejournal.com]

I wrote a story in which a character had a temp of 104.2 and was still coherent and functional (because I was basing this on what had actually happened to me) and I had someone jump all over me for not having the character hospitalized right away. "104--out the door" was what the commentator said to me.

I had to point out I was too stupid to take her advice. :-)

So maybe some people make the temps lower to avoid that sort of crit. I know when I was younger, I was more likely to hallucinate around 103.5 or so...missed a whole day there once as a child!

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

I personally don't think she should have jumped all over you considering how people react to fevers is very individual, and while 104 should be hospital time, it doesn't necessarily have to be. Hell, my son's daycare teacher once called me to say--very casually--that he had a temperature of 104.5 and then was a bit surprised when I freaked the fuck out and called an ambulance. (The teacher got told off, but at least in this case she was right. I learned afterwards that at least with kids, it's not the heat so much as how they're acting.)

Are you sure that thermometer was accurate when you were a kid? I hope you had fun hallucinations, at least!

[sgamadison.livejournal.com]

When I was a kid they only had glass thermometers, so I'm thinking it was pretty accurate. I was sick a lot as a child, but that was the only case I can think of when I lost time. All my hair fell out as well and when it grew back in, it was curly instead of straight. Weird!

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

O.o

I'm really glad you came out all right! And I hope you like your curly hair. :D

[sgamadison.livejournal.com]

I have a love-hate relationship with my hair. It grows like kudzu in a greenhouse and has become coarser with age. Right now I'm in a loathe-it phase and there is nothing I can do but cut it shorter or grow it out. ;-)

[ariadnes-string.livejournal.com]

hey *waves* I hope it's okay to drop in--pingback_bot pinged me when you linked to the meme...

But, clearly, this is something I'm fascinated by, and while I have absolutely no desire to police the content of comment fic fills, I have to say I agree with you!

I am the least fever prone person--I don't think I've run a temperature over 103 in my life (hence the fascination, maybe), so I don't know anything about it personally (and my immediate family is the same) but I do know I've never heard of a real life person actually hallucinating at a temp. under 104.

And since our pediatrician's office basically says not to bother them with anything under 104 (barring other issues, like severe sore throat, etc.), that's the cut off I usually use for fic (though as you say, brain damage won't happen under 105/106). So, I do find it somewhat bewildering when people in fics freak out over a temp of 102 or 103....rush people to the emergency room, etc.

That said, I do think that even a low-grade fever can make you extra emotional or give you crazy dreams. And that's usually how I get around the issue in writing--because I do love it when fever can break down barriers to emotions or memories. But those things can happen through fever dreams you can wake up from (as opposed to delirium, which you can't).

But, of course, the great thing about fever is that it's a symptom, not a disease, and so can effect people in idiosyncratic ways. I get totally weepy with any kind of fever, for example, but my older son can still play a mean game of chess with a temp over 102....

I'm tempted to link the excellent rule-of-thumb chart you have up there to the meme--but, like I said, I hate the idea of policing these mostly super casual fills...

anyway--great post!

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Hello! Thank you for dropping in! You are most welcome. :D

It really is a great meme. I've been zipping over and refreshing the page every chance I get. I'm looking forward to more of the H50 prompts. Fictional fevers rule. Thank you for thinking of it. ♥

I don't think I've ever gone over 103 either, and probably lower than that, which has certainly been bad enough. My doctor down here doesn't mind if I come in for a temperature lower than 104, but then again I live in a smallish American town with lots of doctors and private insurance. :) But they certainly wouldn't send me to the hospital if I was still functional.

In other words, I totally agree with your assessment. ::high fives:: I think you could post a link to that chart if you wanted, just as a resource in case anyone was interested. I'd check it. ;->

[ariadnes-string.livejournal.com]

yes--you're right--I've posted a link--thanks again for that! And very glad you've been enjoying the meme. I'm thrilled there's been a response from so many fandoms, and fills are still coming in, so hopefully it will go on for a while.

Fictional fevers are a blast--though in rl, as you say, they a) hurt and b) are a pretty much a black hole of time, as you spend endless hours either sweating it out yourself or fetching innumerable cups of gingerale for your kids *iz not the most maternal of caretakers*

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

LOL. I can't stand the barfing. God, I can take almost anything except the barfing. But of course I always end up cleaning it up...

I'm very pleased that you posted the fever link. :D I hope other authors start using it.

By the way, I might have, totally by accident, written a fic for the sole Stargate: Atlantis prompt in the comments. It would be here, hypothetically. And I was thinking of you when I wrote it. ;-> I even wanted to add in stuff about fever dreams, but it was getting too long as it was so I decided I'd better not.

Thank you again!

[gottalovev.livejournal.com]

I see 40C way too frequently when taking my son't temperature. He spikes so fast, it's ridiculous. Thank god it generally doesn't stay like that long, though sometimes I had to alternate acetaminophen and ibuprofen every two hours with baths to try and bring him down from more than that. I think he only hallucinated once or it was a fever dream only, hard to say (but he must have been higher, then).

they don't even pull the kids out of school before 38,5C. Heck, if the kid is below that I tell him to buck up and go to school, if he eats or isn't totally apathetic. I consider 102 a 'mild' fever myself. You don't feel so good, sure. Hallucinating? no.

The only time I saw things was with a bad pneumonia, though it was more a fever dream, I got shaken awake and still was a bit in there... tried to explain and I knew I wasn't making sense. I have no idea how much the fever was at that time. bleh. pneumonia. they are a bitch.

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

I feel badly for your kid! (And you--that must be stressful as heck to deal with, especially if it shoots up so fast.)

And wow--I hope I never get pneumonia. :( I'm sorry you had to go through that!

(And icon love! Ryan and Esposito are awesome.)

[mckaysmonkey.livejournal.com]

You reminded me of a friend I shared a house with as a student, who hallucinated while suffering from the flu - she thought it was the flu-strength Lemsip she'd taken (which is actually supposed to bring down the fever).

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

It could have been--some people react weirdly to meds--but it sounds like it was probably the fever. Did she know she was hallucinating?

[mckaysmonkey.livejournal.com]

I think so. I can't be sure though as it was twenty years ago. (yes I'm that old)

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Hey, it sounds like we're almost the same age. ;->

[mckaysmonkey.livejournal.com]

I'm the same age as Rodney :-)

(Well tecnically it's the same age as DH since I don't think they actually tell us Rodney's age in the show!)

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Yep! Pretty darn close. ;->

Fevah!

[anna-bird.livejournal.com]

Chiming in super late to say that with my weird illness last summer, I didn't have any strange thoughts until I went over 104 degrees. (Of course, I should probably check with A. and my sick journal for that month - damn unreliable feverish thinking!) I was uncomfortable up until then, sure. But when I hit 104.6, things got a little...weird, mentally.

I can completely identify with what I'm going to call your mom's increased paranoia; with that stupid fever I was certain that I was A) going to die and B) going to Fire-and-Suffering-Hell and C) it was all because I enjoy reading gay porn. Seriously. I was fucking dead certain.

And then I got the good sulfa drugs, the end. :D So, no hallucinations, but I definitely felt impaired mentally/paranoiacally. (Hah, that's totally not a word, is it.)

Re: Fevah!

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

That is both really cute and sad. First of all, I'm sorry you got so hellishly sick! And I'm also sorry that you've been here long enough to start having that gay = doomed to hell crap branded into your brain, no matter how unwillingly.

But I'm sure you were adorable, even feverishly paranoid. Because how could you not be? ♥

[natsuko1978.livejournal.com]

Still going through posts I missed while I had no net, so thought I would add my tup'pence.

My younger brother was (maybe still is, only now he lives in Australia, so I wouldn't know!) one of those people who got tonsillitis at the drop of a hat, but because he had asthma and later post-viral fatigue syndrome they wouldn't take his tonsils out. Every time he got tonsilitis, without fail, he'd get delirious, even though his temperature never got scary-high. This wasn't just a "little kid" thing - right into his teens and at least up to the point I left home, as far as I know. In our teens, I remember having to *fight* with him once, when Mum left us in the house together so she could go shopping. He was just totally out of it. Maybe the PVF contributed, but there it is.

I, on the other hand, almost never got a fever, no matter how sick I was. (On the other hand, anaesthetic makes me act like I'm drunk and I've failed to recognise my own mother when I've come round before now.)

TL;DR People are individuals and medical generalisations are generalisations. :D As I think you said above.

[taste-is-sweet.livejournal.com]

Your poor brother!

You're not the only one to comment to say that it is possible to become delirious with a low(ish) temperature and I'm definitely willing to believe it. :)